Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2005 00:05:20 EST-10EDT,10,-1,0,7200,3,-1,0,7200,3600 Subject: [UnixOS2_Archive] No. 575 ************************************************** Sunday 03 July 2005 Number 575 ************************************************** Subjects for today 1 Re: The OS/2 and eCS Ecosystem : John Poltorak 2 Re: The OS/2 and eCS Ecosystem : Andreas Buening 3 Re: The OS/2 and eCS Ecosystem : mentore.siesto at libero.it 4 gzip (was: The OS/2 and eCS Ecosystem) : Andreas Buening 5 Re: gzip (was: The OS/2 and eCS Ecosystem) : John Poltorak 6 Re: CPAN : Dave Yeo" 7 Re: gzip (was: The OS/2 and eCS Ecosystem) : Dave Yeo" 8 Re: CPAN : John Poltorak 9 Re: gzip (was: The OS/2 and eCS Ecosystem) : John Poltorak 10 Re: gzip (was: The OS/2 and eCS Ecosystem) : John Poltorak 11 SETMOZENV & UX2BS : John Poltorak 12 Re: gzip (was: The OS/2 and eCS Ecosystem) : Andreas Buening 13 Re: SETMOZENV & UX2BS : Paul Smedley 14 Re: gzip (was: The OS/2 and eCS Ecosystem) : Andreas Buening 15 Re: The OS/2 and eCS Ecosystem : Andreas Buening 16 Re: Subversion : Brian Havard" **= Email 1 ==========================** Date: Sat, 2 Jul 2005 15:47:28 +0100 From: John Poltorak Subject: Re: The OS/2 and eCS Ecosystem On Fri, Jul 01, 2005 at 10:20:06AM -0500, Jeff Robinson wrote: > Neil Waldhauer wrote: > > On Fri, 01 Jul 2005 00:01:16 +0200, Andreas Buening > > wrote: > > > > > >>Somebody who doesn't have any programming knowledge is obviously not > >>the best choice to port an application. For the same reason a developer > >>is not the best choice to write web pages and to setup installation trees > >>because he a) thinks that porting apps is more important than to make > >>an installation system (he's a developer, so what did you think is > >>important for him, of course?) so that he will often "skip" those tasks if > >>he's short on time, and b) he may not know how a new package is added to > >>the distro, or c) he even thinks that nobody needs a installable distro > >>because everything is easy to him. (At this point I apologize to all > >>developers who like to write html pages and to build distros.) > > > > > > No offense taken. I'd like to become involved with the web page and distro end > > of things, myself. But I haven't yet found the build environment (OK, I do have > > and like emx -- gcc 2.8.1) to make this possible. What's the status of our > > web-sites now? > > > > Neil > > Unfortunately I've been rather negligent in keeping the website for > UnixOS2 up to date. Part of that stems from a lot of stuff that has > been going on for me personally, but also trying to figure out the best > way to get things organised. > > I'd like some sort've framework where people could add their own > information or easily submit changes so that someone could update their > pages. > > Heh... and I don't know if I got a fully working UX2BS going, so I > couldn't try and assemble a UnixOS2 environment from that. I guess I > should really re-add that to my list of projects! I think that you really should do that as a top priority. > Though if you're interested in adding/changing information on the pages > you can either let me know what you'd like to see, or the source and > PPWizard files should be available on the UnixOS2.org site. I've been trying to get to grips with Zope recently and it is incredibly powerful but amazingly incomprehnsible. If I was going to put together a Zope site myself, I think I create a folder object for ever app initially and include details of how it should be built. Zope seems to be able to build it's own links for internal pages, but I'm still not sure how... > Jeff > > -- > ---------------- > Whatza JamochaMUD? > http://www.jamochamud.org > > Or other stuff: http://www.anecho.mb.ca/~jeffnik > ----------------------------------------------------------- -- John **= Email 2 ==========================** Date: Sat, 02 Jul 2005 20:15:41 +0200 From: Andreas Buening Subject: Re: The OS/2 and eCS Ecosystem John Poltorak wrote: > > On Sat, Jul 02, 2005 at 12:22:42AM +0200, Andreas Buening wrote: > > Ok, this could happen. But in most cases I'm aware of, a release > > cycle either contains more than one beta release or several weeks > > of time for testing. And there are often also other systems which > > require some fixes. If this helped to get 90% of all packages > > to compile out of the box it would be worth, IMHO. > > I would like to think that once the correct build infrastructure is in > place that most apps would be self maintaining... Is this just a > pipedream? In this specific case, the maintainer added some tests, changed some scripts which, e.g., didn't take into account that the make executable can be 'make.exe' on some systems. The more code is changed, the more likely something will break on some systems. Only regular tests can prevent that. Bye, Andreas **= Email 3 ==========================** Date: Sat, 02 Jul 2005 22:46:49 +0300 From: mentore.siesto at libero.it Subject: Re: The OS/2 and eCS Ecosystem In <20050702105036.C56 at warpix.org>, on 07/02/2005 at 10:50 AM, John Poltorak said: >On Sat, Jul 02, 2005 at 12:23:26AM +0200, Andreas Buening wrote: > >mentore.siesto at libero.it wrote: >> >> > There's also the >> > need to co-ordinate >> > all these efforts. >> >> Very simplified, but yes. >OS/2 developers are very independent. Trying to co-ordinate them is like >herding cats. This is ONE problem. But it's not so hard to solve: in our PIDO/2 documentation initiative (www.ecomstation.it/pido2/), we did set up a webpage to list some interesting targets for Italian documents. Those who want to work on something listed selects it, and the other members will know this. If someone works on something else, no problem, but this is a less important issue. The things to work on are already listed. >It's difficult breaking down a build system into small chunks, but once >it is in place then adding new small chunks is relatively easy. >Currently one small chunk I've overlooked is building GZIP (v1.2.4). It >compiles without any problem using the included OS/2 makefile, but it >doesn't have am INSTALL target, so it isn't possible to run 'make >install'. I wonder if GZIP could be built using the standard 'autoconf, >configure & make' procedure rather than 'make makefile.os2'... I agree. >> e.g., to write a 20 line webpage about blurb. Which then >> can be done by volunteering people with limited time resources >> in finite time. If we could proceed even a small step every week >> or every month there would be a time horizon to reach the final >> goal, and even more important something that could spend >> motivation that "we can do it". Right: how to start this? Do you already have an idea? >Where I lose motivation is when I just can't get something working >especially when others can and I have no idea what I've done wrong or >missed out. When this happens with every app I try, it just makes me want > to through my computers away... Oh yes. Please don't make me remember that I will see AGAIN that horrible winXP desktop from monday to tuesday at lab... -- Mentore Siesto Team OS/2 Italia "Quelle adatte a me non sono disponibili." **= Email 4 ==========================** Date: Sat, 02 Jul 2005 23:00:33 +0200 From: Andreas Buening Subject: gzip (was: The OS/2 and eCS Ecosystem) John Poltorak wrote: > Currently one small chunk I've overlooked is building GZIP (v1.2.4). It > compiles without any problem using the included OS/2 makefile, but it > doesn't have am INSTALL target, so it isn't possible to run 'make > install'. I wonder if GZIP could be built using the standard > 'autoconf, configure & make' procedure rather than 'make makefile.os2'... This is what I call a small and doable task. However, I can't help with gzip 1.2.4, but maybe you want to try 1.3.5: http://unix.os2site.com/sw/pub/source/autoconf/gzip-1.3.5.zip http://unix.os2site.com/sw/pub/source/autoconf/gzip-1.3.5-bin.zip gzip.exe and gunzip.exe seem to work. :-) To rebuild from the original source at ftp.gnu.org: attrib -r * aclocal -I m4 automake -f -a -c autoconf autoheader Hi, Ian, if you're listening: please, could you create a source/gzip/ and binary/gzip/ subdirectory and move the new files there? Bye, Andreas **= Email 5 ==========================** Date: Sat, 2 Jul 2005 22:20:27 +0100 From: John Poltorak Subject: Re: gzip (was: The OS/2 and eCS Ecosystem) On Sat, Jul 02, 2005 at 11:00:33PM +0200, Andreas Buening wrote: > John Poltorak wrote: > > > Currently one small chunk I've overlooked is building GZIP (v1.2.4). It > > compiles without any problem using the included OS/2 makefile, but it > > doesn't have am INSTALL target, so it isn't possible to run 'make > > install'. I wonder if GZIP could be built using the standard > > 'autoconf, configure & make' procedure rather than 'make makefile.os2'... > > This is what I call a small and doable task. However, > I can't help with gzip 1.2.4, but maybe you want to try 1.3.5: > http://unix.os2site.com/sw/pub/source/autoconf/gzip-1.3.5.zip > http://unix.os2site.com/sw/pub/source/autoconf/gzip-1.3.5-bin.zip > gzip.exe and gunzip.exe seem to work. :-) That's great. I haven't tried building it myself yet, but I'll assume I should be able to. My aim is to get all these apps built from source using what I call my 'baseline' toolset. pdksh which awk gzip bzip2 unzip zip crypt regex perl make texi2html gettext byacc flex ncurses help2man autoconf texinfo automake m4 sed grep textutils fileutils shellutils diff patch termcap less Once I've done that satisfactorily, I think UX2BS is at a level which is usable as a standard framework for building a great many other apps. Most of these work fine already but I'm stuck getting the text/shell/file utils built properly. I know the source and patches are available but I can't follow the way Jun Sawataishi, who has produced the latest versions, has built them. If you could assist, then this task would be completed pretty quickly. > > To rebuild from the original source at ftp.gnu.org: > attrib -r * > aclocal -I m4 > automake -f -a -c > autoconf > autoheader > Bye, > Andreas -- John **= Email 6 ==========================** Date: Sat, 02 Jul 2005 14:55:36 -0800 From: "Dave Yeo" Subject: Re: CPAN On Sat, 2 Jul 2005 09:08:12 +0100, John Poltorak wrote: > >Do you know how they got retrieved? On my system it was by Perl >invoking 'wget -O -' which may well have introduced line termination >errors. When using CPAN for the first time a number of programs are >defined. Do you know what CPAN uses on your system? The only extra I added was ncftp. I think it was still using wget. Right now I have a firefox compile happenning and I just discovered you can't be using 2 different builds of perl at once > >> I did notice an error from gzip about stdout being unrecognized os >> something > >Is it possible to log a CPAN session? I don't think so. You can try doing a mode co80,100 to get a 100 line buffer. BTW just notice that perldoc does not work in ux2bs. It does on my own build. I'm now experimenting with CPANPLUS (http://cpan.uwinnipeg.ca/dist/CPANPLUS) which seems to work on my build but dies on ux2bs due to path names like //g:/usr/bin (ux2bs is on G:) Dave **= Email 7 ==========================** Date: Sat, 02 Jul 2005 14:57:49 -0800 From: "Dave Yeo" Subject: Re: gzip (was: The OS/2 and eCS Ecosystem) On Sat, 2 Jul 2005 22:20:27 +0100, John Poltorak wrote: > I know the source and patches are available but I can't >follow the way Jun Sawataishi, who has produced the latest versions, has >built them. Have you tried applying Jun's patch then rerunning autoconf or using the origonal configure and any other autotools that his patch touches? Dave **= Email 8 ==========================** Date: Sun, 3 Jul 2005 10:11:05 +0100 From: John Poltorak Subject: Re: CPAN On Sat, Jul 02, 2005 at 02:55:36PM -0800, Dave Yeo wrote: > On Sat, 2 Jul 2005 09:08:12 +0100, John Poltorak wrote: > > > > >Do you know how they got retrieved? On my system it was by Perl > >invoking 'wget -O -' which may well have introduced line termination > >errors. When using CPAN for the first time a number of programs are > >defined. Do you know what CPAN uses on your system? > > The only extra I added was ncftp. I think it was still using wget. Did wget retrieve any files correctly? Maybe I'll try ncftp and see how it goes. Do you have a URL for ncftp? > Right now I have a firefox compile happenning and I just discovered you > can't be using 2 different builds of perl at once I would like to try and set up UX2BS to handle building Firefox since many of the required tools are already included and I don't like to duplicate programs. > Dave -- John **= Email 9 ==========================** Date: Sun, 3 Jul 2005 10:19:23 +0100 From: John Poltorak Subject: Re: gzip (was: The OS/2 and eCS Ecosystem) On Sat, Jul 02, 2005 at 02:57:49PM -0800, Dave Yeo wrote: > On Sat, 2 Jul 2005 22:20:27 +0100, John Poltorak wrote: > > > I know the source and patches are available but I can't > >follow the way Jun Sawataishi, who has produced the latest versions, has > >built them. > > Have you tried applying Jun's patch then rerunning autoconf or using the origonal configure and any other autotools that his patch touches? Not really - sounds a little tricky. What I should do is just apply the code patches from C_Source.diff and try running autoconf... > Dave > -- John **= Email 10 ==========================** Date: Sun, 3 Jul 2005 10:58:37 +0100 From: John Poltorak Subject: Re: gzip (was: The OS/2 and eCS Ecosystem) On Sat, Jul 02, 2005 at 11:00:33PM +0200, Andreas Buening wrote: > To rebuild from the original source at ftp.gnu.org: The latest source isn't actually there... I presume you mean this:- ftp://alpha.gnu.org/gnu/gzip/gzip-1.3.5.tar.gz > Bye, > Andreas **= Email 11 ==========================** Date: Sun, 3 Jul 2005 11:15:44 +0100 From: John Poltorak Subject: SETMOZENV & UX2BS I'd like to create a SETMOZENV.CMD suitable for building Mozilla under a UX2BS environment. I realise some tools are missing at the moment, but quite a number are already available and I don't want to duplicate programs. The current setup instructions are here:- http://www.mozilla.org/ports/os2/gccsetup.html and the environment setup is here:- http://www.mozilla.org/ports/os2/gcc/setmozenv.cmd I'd like to rationalise it so that it works with UX2BS as well as remove all redundant entries. What do I need to change and what can I remove? -- John **= Email 12 ==========================** Date: Sun, 03 Jul 2005 12:32:29 +0200 From: Andreas Buening Subject: Re: gzip (was: The OS/2 and eCS Ecosystem) John Poltorak wrote: > Once I've done that satisfactorily, I think UX2BS is at a level which is > usable as a standard framework for building a great many other apps. Most > of these work fine already but I'm stuck getting the text/shell/file utils > built properly. I know the source and patches are available but I can't > follow the way Jun Sawataishi, who has produced the latest versions, has > built them. If you could assist, then this task would be completed pretty > quickly. The file/shell/text utilities are (at least) a two day full time job, I guess. So I think they'll have to wait a little bit longer. For gzip I just had to add a missing header, change some shell code twice which relied on a case sensitive file system, remove some duplicate defines and add a test for a missing function to have a define for it. Nothing that could be called "real" porting. Bye, Andreas **= Email 13 ==========================** Date: Sun, 03 Jul 2005 20:10:26 +0930 From: Paul Smedley Subject: Re: SETMOZENV & UX2BS Hi John, Unless ux2bs has at least Innotek GCC 3.2.2 it isn't going to work...... John Poltorak wrote: > I'd like to create a SETMOZENV.CMD suitable for building Mozilla under a > UX2BS environment. I realise some tools are missing at the moment, but > quite a number are already available and I don't want to duplicate > programs. > > > The current setup instructions are here:- > > http://www.mozilla.org/ports/os2/gccsetup.html > > and the environment setup is here:- > > http://www.mozilla.org/ports/os2/gcc/setmozenv.cmd > > I'd like to rationalise it so that it works with UX2BS as well as remove > all redundant entries. > > What do I need to change and what can I remove? > > **= Email 14 ==========================** Date: Sun, 03 Jul 2005 12:33:21 +0200 From: Andreas Buening Subject: Re: gzip (was: The OS/2 and eCS Ecosystem) John Poltorak wrote: > I presume you mean this:- > > ftp://alpha.gnu.org/gnu/gzip/gzip-1.3.5.tar.gz Oh, yes. I didn't realize that I got it from there. Bye, Andreas **= Email 15 ==========================** Date: Sun, 03 Jul 2005 12:32:06 +0200 From: Andreas Buening Subject: Re: The OS/2 and eCS Ecosystem mentore.siesto at libero.it wrote: > > In <20050702105036.C56 at warpix.org>, on 07/02/2005 > at 10:50 AM, John Poltorak said: > >OS/2 developers are very independent. Trying to co-ordinate them is like > >herding cats. > > This is ONE problem. But it's not so hard to solve: in our PIDO/2 > documentation initiative (www.ecomstation.it/pido2/), we did set up a > webpage to list some interesting targets for Italian documents. Those who > want to work on something listed selects it, and the other members will > know this. If someone works on something else, no problem, but this is a > less important issue. The things to work on are already listed. This sounds like a very good idea. > >> e.g., to write a 20 line webpage about blurb. Which then > >> can be done by volunteering people with limited time resources > >> in finite time. If we could proceed even a small step every week > >> or every month there would be a time horizon to reach the final > >> goal, and even more important something that could spend > >> motivation that "we can do it". > > Right: how to start this? Do you already have an idea? Hmm. We could set up a website as you mentioned above. There could be several categories like "development", "package docs", "end user docs", and so on. Some entries could look like: "gzip: support for configure && make" "gzip: package documentation: how to build, known limitations" "gzip: insert latest version into the ux2 distro" Bye, Andreas **= Email 16 ==========================** Date: Sun, 03 Jul 2005 23:19:42 +1000 (EST) From: "Brian Havard" Subject: Re: Subversion On Fri, 1 Jul 2005 15:35:54 +0100, John Poltorak wrote: > >A server of SUBVERSION has just been released and is available here:- > >http://silk.apana.org.au/subversion/ > >Does anyone know how to get it working in INETD mode? I doubt that's going to work without significant mods to svnserve as it expects to communicate using stdin/stdout when started in inetd mode and, if I remember correctly, OS/2's inetd works a bit differently due to the fact that sockets and file handles aren't interchangable. I only tried it in daemon mode. It must be run multithreaded (-T) to work as it's built in OMF mode so no fork(). BTW, I've just got v1.2.0 to build cleanly & will release it when I've tested it for a bit. -- ______________________________________________________________________________ | Brian Havard | "He is not the messiah! | | brianh at kheldar.apana.org.au | He's a very naughty boy!" - Life of Brian | ------------------------------------------------------------------------------